Mead Lover's Digest #1140 18 November 2004
Forum for Discussion of Mead Making and Consuming
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
RE: Sweet Mead question ("Mark Garwatoski")
RE: Mead Lover's Digest #1139, 15 November 2004 (David Chubb)
Re: Mead Lover's Digest #1139, 15 November 2004 (Matt Gerbrandt)
RE: Sweet Mead question ("Greg Osenbach")
RE: Mead Lover's Digest #1139, 15 November 2004 ("Janis Gross")
Re: Slow Fermentation ("Kevin Morgan")
Re: Mead Lover's Digest #1139, 15 November 2004 ("Paul Shouse")
MLD #1139 Honey flavours once fermented ("James P")
Media Coverage of the Meadfest/IMA ("Dan McFeeley")
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Subject: RE: Sweet Mead question
From: "Mark Garwatoski" <mark@food4dogs.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2004 06:30:26 -0500
Your OG wasn't high enough. 3184 has a alc tolerance of about 14% so it
will ferment out to that point. Check some reference tables to see what
a yeast will ferment to and then add additional honey to get the result
you want. At this point you can feed your mead. Just add a pound or two
of honey that has been brought to a boil with a couple cups of water and
stir it in. If you have 5gal of mead each pound of honey will add about
7point to your FG so long as the yeast is pooped out already. So two
pound will get you to ~1.017.
Mark G
I recently made my first mead using Wyeast 3184 - Sweet Mead, with
Original Gravity of 1.1 as of August 15 and today it is 1.003, so
it has roughly 14% alc. by vol. and no significant sugar left -- that
is, it's not a "Sweet Mead" anymore.
Subject: RE: Mead Lover's Digest #1139, 15 November 2004
From: David Chubb <dchubb@virpack.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2004 10:57:39 -0500
> I recently made my first mead using Wyeast 3184 - Sweet Mead, with
> Original Gravity of 1.1 as of August 15 and today it is 1.003, so
> it has roughly 14% alc. by vol. and no significant sugar left
> -- that is,
> it's not a "Sweet Mead" anymore.
>
> It also tastes like piss. Could the 5 teaspoons of Yeast
> Nutrient (in 5
> gallons must) be responsible since the N was likely in the
> form of urea?
> It's honey from a local farm -- bees mainly foraged clover, alfalfa,
> vegetable crop flowers, and wildflowers. Must was boiled. No
> pectic haze.
>
> Strong opinions welcome.
I have also been using the Wyeast 3184. And yes it does ferment out extremly
dry. (I have a 6 gallon batch that started at 1.1-1.2ish range (I don't have
my notebook infront of me) and fermented out to between 16-17% alcohol w/ no
sugar. It was a Vanilla Raspberry mead.
I tried some experiments, the best of which was pulling a 1 gallon pull from
my aging carboy and then sweetening with more honey to taste (about 1.5-2
cups per gallon) and then racking into champagne bottles and being consumed
pretty quickly (before the resulting mixture gets and chance to restart
fermentation...though even with the honey the alcohol content probably only
dropped to 12% or so by taste.
You could try resweetening and let it sit for a month or so to make sure
fermentation doesn't restart before bottling. (I fit the finger of a
surgical glove over the top of my airlock and check for expansion....my
carboys live in the basement where the temperature starts relatively
constant.)
I have done a couple batches using the Wyeast English Cider yeast and it
seems to work better for sweet meads as it only lasts till around 10-11%
alcohol.
Alternatively you could stop the fermentation at the correct point using
sulfites. (Personally I don't since my wife is violently allergic to
sulfites)
- --David
Subject: Re: Mead Lover's Digest #1139, 15 November 2004
From: Matt Gerbrandt <matthewgerbrandt@yahoo.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2004 08:04:51 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Sweet Mead question
From: "robscott@freeshell.org"
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2004 22:46:08 +0000 (UTC)
...It also tastes like piss. Could the 5 teaspoons of Yeast Nutrient (in 5
gallons must) be responsible since the N was likely in the form of urea?
It's honey from a local farm -- bees mainly foraged clover, alfalfa,
vegetable crop flowers, and wildflowers. Must was boiled. No pectic haze.
Strong opinions welcome.
Rob:
That does seem like an excessive amount of nutrient and is likely to
be the problem. Probably half or less of that amount would have been
sufficient. Further, boiling honey can do strange things to its flavor.
Not only will you lose the delicate honey aroma, you can also end up with
"grassy" flavors from boiling the honey. Honey doesn't need or benefit
from boiling. Sulfites are also un-necessary. Next time, just dissolve
the honey in about a gallon of hot water (100F) and bring it up to the 5
gallon total volume in the carboy. Also, you had no pectic haze because
you didn't add any fruit or other source of pectin as far as I can tell.
If you're interested in mead making, I'd strongly recommend you buy a copy
of The Compleat Mead Maker by Ken Schramm. Just follow one of his recipes
and you'll end up with something amazing.
- -Matt
Subject: RE: Sweet Mead question
From: "Greg Osenbach" <Greg@carecontrols.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2004 08:15:01 -0800
I would say rack it into a fresh carboy, put an airlock on it, and shove
it into a corner for another month or two. Re rack if necessary. Then
let it sit for a few more months.
All my mead tastes bad right after fermenting, aging will remove the
strong alcohol taste and the sweet/honey flavors will come out. If it
is still a bit dry after aging, you can add a bit more honey to it as
well.
Spike
Subject: Sweet Mead question
From: "robscott@freeshell.org" <robscott@freeshell.org>
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2004 22:46:08 +0000 (UTC)
Hi!
I recently made my first mead using Wyeast 3184 - Sweet Mead, with
Original Gravity of 1.1 as of August 15 and today it is 1.003, so
it has roughly 14% alc. by vol. and no significant sugar left -- that is,
it's not a "Sweet Mead" anymore.
It also tastes like piss. Could the 5 teaspoons of Yeast Nutrient (in 5
gallons must) be responsible since the N was likely in the form of urea?
It's honey from a local farm -- bees mainly foraged clover, alfalfa,
vegetable crop flowers, and wildflowers. Must was boiled. No pectic
haze.
Strong opinions welcome.
Rob Scott
Subject: RE: Mead Lover's Digest #1139, 15 November 2004
From: "Janis Gross" <totallygross@hotmail.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2004 10:47:01 -0700
Hi Rob,
I had the same experience when I used the Wyeast 3184. I made 10 gallons of
huckleberry mead (1.122) and pitched Wyeast 3184 in 5 gallons and White Labs
WLP 720 Sweet Mead yeast in the other 5 gallons. After 3 months the Wyeast
3184 was at 1.002 and the WLP 720 was at 1.036: too dry and too sweet. In
the end, I blended the batches and ended with a final blended gravity of
~1.030. The blended mead was excellent, and the sweetness was nicely
balanced with the tartness of the huckleberries.
I am just about to perform a yeast experiment on a 5 gallon batch of mead.
I'll spilt it into gallon jugs and pitch a different yeast in each. I'll
post my results in a few months.
As for the nutriuent, yes, I believe you used about twice as much nutrient
as you needed. You may want to let the mead age to see if that helps, or,
you could blend it with another must (no nutrient added) and see if that
helps. Whatever you do, don't throw it out!
Cheers!
Janis [8-)
- -=-=-=-=-=-<snip>=-=-=-=-=
>Hi!
>
>I recently made my first mead using Wyeast 3184 - Sweet Mead, with
>Original Gravity of 1.1 as of August 15 and today it is 1.003, so
>it has roughly 14% alc. by vol. and no significant sugar left -- that
is,
>it's not a "Sweet Mead" anymore.
>
>It also tastes like piss. Could the 5 teaspoons of Yeast Nutrient (in 5
>gallons must) be responsible since the N was likely in the form of urea?
>It's honey from a local farm -- bees mainly foraged clover, alfalfa,
>vegetable crop flowers, and wildflowers. Must was boiled. No pectic
haze.
>
>Strong opinions welcome.
>
>Rob Scott
>
Subject: Re: Slow Fermentation
From: "Kevin Morgan" <kevin.morgan2@verizon.net>
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2004 18:36:42 -0500
Steve: Need more info like what is the O.G.? Did you
aerate/oxygenate? How old was the yeast you pitched?
Was the starter pitched at high crausen? etc
I make mostly melomels myself, but I don't add the fruit until the
secondary, so, the initial fermentation is just
Honey water and nutrients and yeast. I have found that if the O.G. is
much above 1.100 it is difficult to get the
yeast to start. Also, the higher the O.G. the more I need to aerate
the must.
Kevin, Brewing and Meading in South Jersey (USA)
Subject: Slow Fermentation
From: SRNagley@aol.com
>Snip
Am I confined to making melomels only?
In the first mead I added the acid when starting the mead, but since
reading ???The Complete Meadmaker??? decided to hold off doing the acid
balancing until completion. ???That???s what I must be doing wrong??? I
thought. Apparently not as I???m stuck again. I have pitched 3 different
yeast over the course of 4 weeks since starting my latest mead and I keep
being encouraged by what appears to be activity, but the gravity hasn???t
moved but ~ 1 Brix in that time. I rehydrated the initial yeast pitched
(Cotes de Blanc ??? sp), made a starter using dry malt extract on the
second attempt (a champagne yeast) and just sprinkled the third yeast
(also a champagne) on the surface. I thought the temp might be a little
cool so I pumped up the heat to between 75 & 80 F.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Steve Nagley
Old Forge, Pa
Subject: Re: Mead Lover's Digest #1139, 15 November 2004
From: "Paul Shouse" <paul_shouse@kmug.org>
Date: Wed, 17 Nov 2004 09:14:14 +0900
>>robscott@freeshell.org writes:
>
>I recently made my first mead using Wyeast 3184 - Sweet Mead, with
>Original Gravity of 1.1 as of August 15 and today it is 1.003, so
>it has roughly 14% alc. by vol. and no significant sugar left -- that is,
>it's not a "Sweet Mead" anymore.
>
>It also tastes like piss. Could the 5 teaspoons of Yeast Nutrient (in 5
>gallons must) be responsible since the N was likely in the form of urea?
>It's honey from a local farm -- bees mainly foraged clover, alfalfa,
vegetable crop flowers, and wildflowers. Must was boiled. No pectic haze.
Strong opinions welcome.
Rob Scott
Rob-
I have never had consistent results with either of the Wyeast Mead yeasts, and
no longer use them. As for the nutrient, you're lucky it only tastes like
piss, which is after all a natural, organic and relatively pleasant substance.
I have seen nutrients in stores without labels or instructions, always a
danger to the inoocent. It sounds like you got hold of one that should have
been boiled in the brewing water rather than added to the must, and that you
used far too much of it.
My latest theory is that freezing a peeled slice of apple then thawing it and
dropping it into the primary will provide enough nutrient for the yeast
without contributing a noticeable flavor to the finished mead, especially if a
'fruity' yeast is used. I'm going to test this out with my next batch: two
three-gallon carboys with identical musts and yeasts, one with apple and one
without. I expect that one will finish out in three months, the other in
twelve.
- -Paul
Subject: MLD #1139 Honey flavours once fermented
From: "James P" <jlp765@hotmail.com>
Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 12:50:58 +1000
>Has anyone done a comparison of what different honeys taste like
>once fermented? Without anything else added (not even nutrients)?
>It could prove to be an interesting exercise.
Aaron,
I asked a similar question on the GotMead forum
(http://gotmead.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=natural;action=display;num=1093398322;start=10#10),
and didn't get a response that identified "something close to oenology in
winemaking" for mead.
UC Davis worked on a flavour wheel for describing wine. The mead/honey
industry doesn't have the clout or money to pay for the developing of a
similar resource for describing honey.
I've visited a honey tasting facility, but I'm not able to describe the
differences between the various varieties to a suitable "qualitative"
level, let alone to a quantitative level.
However, the MLD can start the ball rolling, by providing "flavour
descriptors" for identifying the various flavours in honey (pre-ferment
or post-ferment).
I guess there needs to be descriptions for honey, and descriptions for the
honey without sweetness (mead), and then we will have a guide for selecting
honey to provide a particular
flavour profile in a mead.
James
Subject: Media Coverage of the Meadfest/IMA
From: "Dan McFeeley" <mcfeeley@keynet.net>
Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 08:56:38 -0600
Good article on this year's International Meadfest and the
International Mead Association at this URL:
http://www.dailycamera.com/bdc/cda/article_print/0,1983,BDC_2517_3287519_ARTICLE-DETAIL-PRINT,00.html
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Dan McFeeley
End of Mead Lover's Digest #1140
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